At what point do you draw the line?

[Demonic Rainbows]

Okay, so first off this is not directed at anyone in particular... or even myself. My current relationship is actually going pretty great.

I've recently returned to the site after my boyfriend moved across state for university. I was basically looking for moral support during those hard times. Even if I don't post much, it sometimes helps to read that I'm not alone in my own personal and relationship struggles. While browsing threads, there is a common theme that I've noticed, and I thought I'd start a (current) discussion surrounding it...

At what point do you stop being "understanding" and start being "naive"?

I realize that in a long distance relationship you need: trust, understanding, patience, and communication (among other things). But... at what point do you take off the rose colored glasses and see that your significant other isn't who you thought they were? Obviously this is a fine line... No one ever wants to be the anxious and paranoid significant other who is constantly accusing their partner of disloyalty or lying. In a long distance relationship, you really need to have a strong hold of any jealousy issues, and be careful what battles you choose. At the same time, there comes a point where you may seriously need to assess your relationship and face reality.

So where do you draw the line?

I say this as someone who overlooked numerous red flags in a relationship that wasn't even long distance... I was so infatuated with my boyfriend at the time that I ignored signs that would later tell me we just weren't right together. We stayed together far too long, and ultimately ended our relationship on a sour note. I honestly just wanted to have a discussion on this... I don't think there's a "wrong" or "right" answer, but it is something I've been wondering after browsing the threads these past couple of weeks.

[differentcountries]

As based on prior experience I draw the line at:
- having no sense of hygene (sounds silly perhaps, but my sort of ex showered too seldom and now looks like a hobo)
- lying (I may help you stop lying, but I expect you to in the end tell the truth to me and everyone...well, perhaps not your stupid boss)
- witholding/not being sincere and open
- showing great disregard for my feelings....yes, sometimes silly things mean a lot to me, but I also indulge you sometimes, so would you please do this for my sake?
- not contributing to every day life. I am fine doing more than my share for a while, but I am not the maid.
- not looking to and planning for the future...within reson. For instance I exect to have a say in where my boyfriend will live and work, even if the final decition is his

[Demonic Rainbows]

So I guess this question can be answered in a number of ways... Perhaps I didn't word it properly.

When it comes to matters of reality or paranoia, I really listen to my intuition. If something doesn't feel right, I ask myself 'why?'. If I can't come up with a logical reason, I drop it. If there is a legitimate reason to be feeling uneasy, I address it.

I was with someone for too long because I didn't listen to my intuition. There were obvious signs of lying and disloyalty, but I ignored them. I was naive and convinced myself that it was all in my head. While there is some merit to this thinking, I believe there comes a point where reality needs to step in.

I've noticed many people online and in my personal life that fall into this trap... They don't want to be the paranoid significant other, so they let themselves become naive to obvious sketchy situations. There's only so many excuses you can make for someone, and eventually you need to pay attention to the signs around you.

I guess that's where I draw the line.

[hmrambling]

There are different stages in relationships, and those stages are because it takes a while to get to know a person.

So many times we see here (on this site AND with our friends and family) that people fall into the pitfalls of what I call 'insta-relationships'. They dive right into relationships with people they have not taken the time to get to know. These people choose naivety. They have chosen to not pay attention to red flags, and are not going through the stages in relationships and dating. Their pace is fast, and they commit right away without getting to know the person. If the person is dishonest, they don't see it. Disloyal? They don't see it. Not trustworthy? Don't see it. They are too consumed by being in their insta-relationship to heed to what their conscience tells them. A lot of the times, these insta-relationships are filled with chaos, intensity, drama, and excitement. And we see a LOT of these posts here.

I suppose I drew the line when I had enough. It is exhausting to maintain an insta-relationship, to try to trust someone who is not trustworthy, who is not loyal, and who is dishonest. It's exhausting to constantly deal with drama, chaos, intensity, and excitement. And it's not healthy.

I took a break from relationships and dating for a year. I autopsied major relationships and found that they had one common denominator: ME. I also saw patterns, and how I settled for these insta-relationships without properly dating and taking the time to know someone. I made it a point to take time to know someone. I actually dated. We had and still have dates. I make a conscience effort to get to know the person I'm dating. I ask questions. I put on my big girl pants and practice some patience instead of jumping right into a relationship and planning a future with someone.

I believe when we draw the line is when we choose to do things different than we have in the past by looking out for red flags and trusting our intuition. I believe society as a whole is driven by instant gratification and that most people want relationships in the time that it takes to drive through a fast food drive through window.

They settle for netspeak text messages instead of phone calls. They don't take the time to talk over dinner and/or coffee, and are too busy renting U-Hauls and moving people in without knowing them. Media, film, movies, and music all endorse this insta-relationship mentality and mindset. Movies tell us that love is at first sight, that relationships are built over night, that rushed weddings are romantic, and that everyone lives happily ever after... music does, too. Then it tells us that when it doesn't work out, that the guy should persistently chase the girl after she leaves him, and that she will come back... How many times have we seen movies with couples getting back together when a guy goes and finds the girl in the airport (who was trying to leave him)? This is the chaos, drama, intensity, and excitement that we are sold by the media, movies, film, and music industries... and we welcome it in until we are exhausted. And then, when we are exhausted with the unhealthy behaviors, we might try a different approach and hopefully get a different outcome.

Unhealthy relationships are exhausting. Take the time to get to know the other person. Date (for a change). Ask questions. Remember that you are special and valuable, and that you don't *need* another person to tell you that. Plus, talk is cheap. Anyone can say those words, but can they walk the walk?

I guess I draw the line when I discern that what a lot of other people think is love is NOT really love, and that I am worth it to not settle for what the majority of people think is love.

Wrote a poem about it a while ago...

What love is - a reminder to self

Love is not looking into her eyes and “just knowing.”
It's a decision.
It's decision to be vulnerable
To share yourself
To listen
Having the courage to fight
Knowing when to let go
And knowing when to be there for her.
It is not “just knowing”, I tell you.
When she looks up, and her eyes meet yours,
it never is as simple as imagining what
she's thinking while she looks at you.
It is having the courage to speak up
and having the ability to ask,
“What do you need from me?”
“What can I do for you?”
“How can I help?”
And it is taking the time to listen.
It is not “just knowing”
It is not gazing into her eyes
Reading her mind
Guessing her thoughts
Making up conversations in your head
Wishing she could read your mind
No, that is not love.
The movies, they tell you wrong
The songs, they lie, too.
When she says she wants to be left alone,
she probably really does.
Don’t chase.
When she says she needs time,
she probably really does.
Give her time.
When she says that she loves,
She probably really does.
Believe her.
And return love to her
if you love her,
and if you know what love is.
It is a decision.
A decision to be vulnerable,
to share yourself,
and to listen.

Yup, that's pretty much where I draw the line.

[Harlequin]

I don't know if there really is a definitive line to draw. Different people will tolerate different things, so I guess it really depends on when the specific person has had enough. If they ever have enough.

I was dating a guy in Belfast, and one day he just disappeared. That day turned into two weeks, and I ended up having to get in touch with his sister in order to find out where the hell he went. I don't require a whole lot of communication in general, so it didn't really bother me when he had disappeared for the first week. By the second week, I wondered if maybe something had happened to him. Turns out he was more or less fine, but was just coping with a very sudden and brutal loss of a friend and shut out everyone. I felt like I couldn't really fault him for that, so I forgave him and he promised he wouldn't do that again. He kept that up for about a day, and after 3 days of not hearing from him, I ended the relationship. He didn't even check his phone for days after I sent the message.
I wasn't faulting him for grieving, but I was going through a lot of my own crap and he knew this. He'd started to disappear for days at a time before the loss of his friend, so that was really more the straw that broke the camel's back more than anything else. But it took me 7(? I honestly don't remember) months and a lot of excuses to get there. So for me, I draw the line when I finally have that moment of realization that I'm making nothing but excuses.

Now, I have a friend who will have to be broken up with every time if a relationship is falling apart. She will not break up with a boyfriend regardless of whatever he's doing or how the relationship is going. Her current boyfriend is a giant ass bag, and I'm pretty sure she's also aware of it, but she's constantly making excuses for him. But for her, she doesn't really have the greatest self esteem, and it seems like she really just sorta dates anyone who expresses interest in her. She's afraid interested men aren't going to come by frequently enough, and since she's very much obsessed with the idea of getting married and starting a family, she basically latches on to one relationship and refuses to let go unless the guy breaks it off. She kinda figures she'll never get anything better than the guy she's currently with, so she'll excuse every warning sign for the sake of keeping a relationship.
So for her, there is no line to draw.

Then there are immediate deal breakers, and those are also subjective. So I guess it really just depends on the person and the factors involved.

[differentcountries]

There's only so many excuses you can make for someone, and eventually you need to pay attention to the signs around you.

I guess that's where I draw the line.

Don't think I have ever made excuses for anyone. But I used to be more scared about a relationship ending than it turning out bad. I also used to harbour some naive ideas about love, for instance that people who love each other don't hurt each other. Now I have the experience of relationships turning very bad, and avoiding that situation mean more to me than securing that the relationship continues. I also think I learned some useful things about psycology.So I feel more in control...by accepting I can't control, but I can influence.

I guess me and SO did have an insta-relationship, although only with a minimum level of drama, but it was exhausting to find out hey! this is the (other) love of your life, do you want to spend all your money just to visit? Not to mention it was SOs first ever time to fall in love....which I guess he told me, but it sounded so surreal I did not believe it! And he sometimes wanted to draw the line over the distance, or poly, and he was mean to me at times. I told myself, I will give it a year. If he is not over it by then, I doubt he ever will be and I will have to let him go. So, for me there was this mental time line. I could not have lived forever with him going "I feel like being in a fast car with no driver", even though I am sure that is how it felt like to him, because to me I only wanted to enjoy having met him and know he enjoyed my company too.