I now know the truth about Francesco

[Zapookie]

Ah, I had always wondered what happened to you. How do you know he is part of this group? Did you even visit him?

If after all this time, Francesco hasn't been willing to pursue a friendship nor a relationship with you, I think it's safe to say that it's not really any of your business whether he is in this group or not. Your actions will probably have very little effect on him.

[WhiteValkyrie]

I think you guys are missing the point.


I did forget about him for a while after I tried to contact him. But when I found out how dangerous the cult was, and how, no, no one chooses to be in the cult, they are recruited and not told to do the destructive or dangerous aspects of it until they are suffficiently weakened. Why would a cult limit itself to only gaining stupid members ( a minority of any population) and why would it benefit from having dummies in its ranks? not good PR.


I was angry at him until I learned the cult made him behave the way he did. To be frank, I had a right to be angry and plan to do what I would have done, had I not wised up and realized I didn't know the level of his guilt. Now I know he's not an asshole, he's a cult member. He was very excited to meet me, probably because he knew I could join the cult with him. He may have loved me, maybe not, but it's true that he was definitely not capable of healthy love, based on what I know the cult teaches about love. When I suggested premarital sex, if we were to meet, what happened was that the cult probably told him to stop talking to me. Honestly, that's not "playing with me". That's something different.

Former cult members have told me that although he seemed like he loved me, or at least liked me very much, that his behavior is definitely influenced by the cult. Sorry, but we got really close, and if it's possible for me to feel that strongly about him, it's possible for him to have felt that strongly about me. He wouldn't have stopped contacting me unless something had changed. He definitely felt something for me, and he was diappointed because I was not "cult material", the former member say. Also, no one would just get rid of a friendship like that, or give no explanation. Well, some people woudl, but Fran wasn't that jerky sort.


Excuse me for having a week or two of initial anger after being unfairly dropped (given no explanation, and no continuation of at least a friendship, or, heaven forbid, a note of some sorts). Until you're in my shoes, don't judge me.


And for your information, every former cult member or exit counselor I've discussed this with has never told me I was "obsessive" or wrong to pursue helping Francesco and getting a friendship back. They've all told me I am a blessing and a godsend that I am willing to remember and want to help him after all this time. They tell me they wish they had someone remember them like I remember and am not going to give up on Francesco. It's not the time you spend talking to someone- it's the quality and the depth with which you felt their soul.


This sect forbids members to love anyone, including the spouses it arranges for them, and when it found out Francesco was starting to get the first rudimentary feelings of love for me, or at least an inkling of them, it also didn't think this was good. Love is not allowed, even for one's wife and children. Should I turn my back as Francesco is sucked into that? Or should I talk to exit counselors and try the best strategy to get him out? What if he has children one day, and they are going to suffer?


It's not the amount of time you spend with someone, nor the fact that you meet or touch them. It's the fact that you touch something in their soul, and connect with them. that's what makes love. this is why penpals can love each other, having never met. Do I know everything about Francesco? no. But I know a lot of his deepest darkest secrets, and I do know that it's not just what I knew about him, it's the whole way we "clicked" together, how he was someone who saw the world they way I did.


Nor do I believe love is one-sided. If you love someone- that is, if you see a part of yourself in their soul or subconscious or whatever, it's there. They love you too, but do not realize it. If Francesco isnt the person I think he is, then I do not love him. But I still have the duty to help him.


For the record, he is not happy because he said so himself to me. He said he cries a lot, and doesnt' think he's a special person. He just didn't attribute this to the sect, but to his own nature, which members of sects are often prone to do. They blame themselves for the sect's abuse.


Yes, normal people (though not kind or moral people) often ignore others, but they do not get rid of their entire internet existence or profile. I know for a fact this cult forces people to drop contact with those it deems a "bad influence". I also know that most people who ignore others do not obliterate their own profiles, because they could always just ignore the person. However, this sect tells people to use Internet sparingly, saying it breaks up their relationship with the cult, because they may read "the bad stuff the Devil wrote about the cult" on the Internet. The reason his whole profile had to be deleted was not to prevent him from contacting me (he could just choose to do so) but to prevent me from influencing him (against the cult).


Besides, I don't know what the hell an OP is, and I suspect it's some dumb psychotherapy term. Excuse me for thinking people on a site called "loving from a distance" should believe that someone can fall in love, or at least start to, or at least come to love someone platonically, online, that is, from a distance. I guess the title of this site is misleading. And excuse me that I should be committed to helping my friend.


I do, as a human being, have the right not to be ignored, even if we do not find we fit together romantically. I do have a right to try to help him as much as possible, especially since, if the sect arranges him into a marriage and pops some kids out of him, there will be others at stake because of his involvement if that ever happens.


I love the man, he was my friend once, and something unnatural came between us. Most people would not break off contact when and how he did. I knew something was up, and it's the cult. People who do not want a relationship say so, and directly tell people why they cut it off. Francesco did not do that, and there is no question that this is wrong behavior and that I need and deserve an answer. But now I know it's not his fault, and I forgive him totally.


Excuse me for thinking God sent me to "meet" him online and maybe help him out of this cult. And excuse me for thinking that if I could love Francesco as much as I do, and if he could love a woman he was in a long distance relationship with for 2 years (before I knew him) and that he could love a boy he had as a penpal from his childhood, that heaven forbid he might at least love me as a friend and just not realize it anymore, because of an unfortunate cult experience which left him thinking I was Satan.

[WhiteValkyrie]

I know he's a part of the group because he told me. He didn't tell me it was a cult, in fact, specifically said they are not a cult. But a quick search in the right places proves otherwise. I didn't realize it was a cult until I researched later. Many ex members are stressing the importance of getting him out of it.

The good news is most cult members leave their cults, and the longer they are in, the unhappier they become.

[WhiteValkyrie]

He did not willingly join it. No one willing joins these groups. They are led on with false premises and recruited at weak times in their lives. Heaven forbid there still be people in this world who love others and believe that love means how you feel about someone, and not whether you've met or touched or "been in a relationship" or had some other "workable" thing going on with them.

Love is a connection between two people, not a contract or a set of activities or some kind of "project" that "works" or not.

Frankly, I think the fact that I should meet him online was a bit of a stroke of fate, because perhaps I can get him out of the cult, and if not him, then at least open up other people to its dangers.


And for the record I did not suddenly go from loving him and trying to meet him to going to get him out of the cult. I found out he was in a cult, and this is what put it all in perspective for me, explained all his behavior towards me, etc.

[lademoiselle]

I'm not going to comment on the whole case, I just wanted to point out that OP stands for original poster - nothing more.

[WhiteValkyrie]

No, no normal person just leaves people without giving them an explanation. And frankly, even if many non-cult involved people act that way, most of them do not delete their profiles. They just ignore the person. The cult he's in is anti-Internet, because they say it turns people away from the cult.

He at least had friendly love for me, and there was no normal reason to let that go. He was looking for someone who could join the cult with him, and that wasn't me, but the cult took our friendship away as well.

[TwoThree]

You are a very scary person who belongs in a mental health institution.

[WhiteValkyrie]

You are a very shallow person who belongs not in a society where people have love, feelings, and hope.

[TwoThree]

You keep telling yourself that.

[Tooki]

I have had girls cut off contact with me, not unlike the manner in which Francesco did to you.

I realised that people who do that aren't worth your time. I let go, and moved on. You need to do the same thing.

I'll leave it at that, but you should get some help.

[Schlafmütze]

Pop Corn Time!!

[Mellow]

It's a difficult situation, we understand that... But really, why would you make a forum post about it when you are just going to push every advice away. Some people are trying hard to help you out a little.

I can only say, whatever you are planning on doing, just be careful...

[XxFranticLovexX]

Okay.. I was going to stay away from this thread but I went back and read your other posts as well..

What makes you so sure that he's in a cult and not just trying to get away from you because you're creepy and crazy? You said yourself that he had a relationship with someone before and was wanting to move to them/them move to him.. and that he was cybering with you. Honestly, it sounds like he is just trying to get away from you. I also don't know what makes you sure that he deleted all of his accounts.. he could have just blocked you on all of them. You wouldn't be able to see anything he does on them and it would look like they had been deleted.

Love isn't one sided. It can be, but it usually isn't. Infatuation and obsession are.

Really chick, just realize that you're the one in the wrong here. If everyone around you is telling you the same thing then it should register to you that something isn't right with what you're doing.. not just make you believe that they're all wrong.

Also.. if you still plan to go the revenge route, I don't think you really grasp how that works. Emotional pain = emotional revenge, physical pain = physical revenge. You don't deal both for one. You also don't try to act on 'karma' yourself. Revenge =/= karma.

[kittyo9]

He did not willingly join it. No one willing joins these groups. They are led on with false premises and recruited at weak times in their lives.

That is still willing. No one forged his signature. Free will means being able to make your own decisions, with or without the appropriate information.

And you need to give it up. It's not your life, he doesn't want you there, and you need to butt out. You are not his hero. You know what NORMAL people do? Respect others' decisions. While I respect your decision to continue, my advice to you is to sit down, shut up, and address your own problems because it is not healthy in any way to be this obsessed (yes, I said obsessed, because you are! You want to control his life and will stop at nothing until you can) with someone who has CLEARLY indicated, cult or not, that he wants nothing to do with you.

Not being ignored is not a right. You have the right to ignore someone (as you do here, ignoring advice), and therefore you also have the right to be ignored.

"People who do not want a relationship say so." False. Some people are not as direct, and rely on alternate methods to communicate their lack of interest. The method he used with you? Excluding you from his life. Clearly you do not interpret non-verbal cues very well.

"Nor do I believe love is one-sided. If you love someone- that is, if you see a part of yourself in their soul or subconscious or whatever, it's there. They love you too, but do not realize it." False. This is psychotic. You cannot make someone love you. This ties back into your control issues that I mentioned earlier. I'm sure you'll try to defend yourself, but there is nothing to defend.

Additionally, your "love" (the "connection between two people") is one-sided, so I don't know what you're after. You are pining from a distance.

Yes, normal people delete their online profiles and existences. It happens. I've had several friends do this as a personal form of cleansing. Yes, people can live their lives away from the internet just fine.

Your whole premise is that God has sent you on some crusade to rescue him from this cult's terrible ways. What if God has sent you to this forum to help you realize that what you're really doing is Devil's work? You'd probably say I'm the one doing Devil's work, wouldn't you? How do you know you're right?

If people generally leave the cult, why don't you have a little faith in him to do it on his own? Why are you making his life about you?

[Chris516]

You'd be surprised... I had a very intelligent and kind female friend who used to identify as bisexual (and had a girlfriend) who got recruited to the "Christian 180" group (which can be considered a cult) on her campus and now denounces homosexuality in every way (including shutting out her ex girlfriend from her life) and only updates facebook with bible verses. It's not really forcing them, because they willingly buy into it.

I'm concerned by what kteire says.

Your friend(or former friend) denouncing homosexuality is not the potential problem. The potential problem is, if the group she joined, turns out to be anything like the Branch Davidians who used the Bible as a guise for stockpiling weapons. Or like Jim Jones who used the Bible as the door to getting people to join his 'utopia' in Guyana. Or Marshall Applewhite, who used the Bible to recruit people to join him on 'ascension to the mother ship'.

Becoming Christian, is not joining a cult. A cult is an entity that uses deceptive mind-altering techniques, like the ones' I mentioned above.

P.S. I am Christian, and don't agree with homosexuality, or the legitimization of it. But I am not a member of a cult because I am a Christian