is he doubting me?

[Hyacinth]

Well, what do you have to lose by visiting him?
If you've decided to go, then be positive.Reassureyourself and reassure him. Then, make the most of the trip. Have fun! Stop over thinking this. You'll be in a better position to know which way to head after you've met.
IMHO, there's no right or wrong thing to do. It's what you want to and are willing to do to make this work. Every relationship, specially LD ones, involve an element of risk. It's up to us to make the most of it knowing things don't always work out

[innocentbutterfly]

well no loss, except id be a fool to give up my virginity if he isnt the one, since he kind of i dont know that, always mentions that somehow when talk comes up about me coming. But i told him, no feelings, no nothing. Because sex is kinda involved when ldr's meet with all the wait, no?

[Hollandia]

well no loss, except id be a fool to give up my virginity if he isn't the one, since he kind of i don't know that, always mentions that somehow when talk comes up about me coming. But i told him, no feelings, no nothing. Because sex is kinda involved when ldr's meet with all the wait, no?

Whoah! This sets off a red flag for me. Sex is sex. It is not something that should be assumed because of an LDR. You should sleep with someone when you are ready and you want to. Do not let anyone guilt you into it and make you feel you owe it to them for any reason. The R in an LDR is "relationship" , if you don't have the R you don't have an LDR, you just have buddies hanging out. Sex with buddies are "F#$@ buddies" and IMHO you don't want to fall into that category. Once you do, you cannot get out of it.

[lyonsgirl]

well no loss, except id be a fool to give up my virginity if he isnt the one, since he kind of i dont know that, always mentions that somehow when talk comes up about me coming. But i told him, no feelings, no nothing. Because sex is kinda involved when ldr's meet with all the wait, no?

Like Hollandia said.... Sex is sex. You need to talk to him about this. You are, first and foremost, in a relationship. The "long distance" is just an adjective of your relationship. Similar to "military" or "close distance" or anything else. If you're not comfortable with it - you DO NOT have to have sex with him. You really don't, I promise. And if he gets mad at you for saying you don't want to, then he's not "the one".

edited for clarity.

[ThePiedPiper]

Wait, so, you're telling him "no feelings, no nothing, and oh yeah, sex is always involved" but you're complaining because you don't want to lose your virginity if he's not the man you're going to marry.

You're upset that he doesn't detail his outings but tells you the normal amount that most normal people share (hate to say it, but some of us don't give play-by-plays. If someone asks me how my days was, I'll tell them I worked or I volunteered at the shelter or I tried burlesque for the first time and it was fun but that's about it) and you get insecure about it, yet you're complaining because he's insecure.

You're saying you put more effort into the relationship because you're going to see him but you didn't even pay for your own ticket. He did.

You're going through your own insecure emotions and reading into everything he's saying and wondering whether or not you can trust him and he's sincere, and yet you complain that he did the same thing to someone he's close to.

He's being rational because he's deciding to wait and see how you click in real life and how your relationship continues to flourish before he asks you give up everything for him, and yet you're complaining about that.

In addition to all of this, I think it's unfair to say he didn't use his free week to see you (depending on what he does, sometimes you simply need downtime and a first visit is not downtime with all the stress and anxiety and things that go into it), and it's unfair to say he's not invested in the relationship because you're convinced you're soulmates without having met and he's not. Sometimes people are not the same person that they are online and sometimes they are but you learn something about them that's a dealbreaker for you. I don't think he's being unfair or unrealistic to say put a hold on the wedding ceremony until after you've met.

Frankly, I think you are overreacting and I think you're being hypocritical. You're holding him to standards you're violating with your own thoughts and emotions and while that's okay, and I'd argue that it's normal (first visits are always a little bit weird), you can't hold him to a standard you can't meet because you're both only human. He's entitled to all his feelings and quite frankly, I see absolutely nothing wrong with what he's saying or doing. Let him have his thoughts and feelings and stop taking them so personally and stop expecting him to act or think in ways even you yourself aren't doing. He bought your damn ticket for you so it's quite clear that he wants to see you. I would crack most of this up to nerves and be done with it because it's not worth arguing over or stressing out about.

[Verojoon]

I agree with a lot of what Piper said but I think it's hard to see the situation clearly when you're in the middle of it.

Before I met my SO in person, he said a lot of the things your SO said. It made me crazy because one moment he would say I was the mot important things in his life, and the next moment he said that it wasn't a "real" relationship. We were both very insecure about the whole thing (and who wouldn't be, it's a scary thing to take the relationship up a level by meeting in person...) and it came through in different ways.

My SO and I were both not virgins when we met, and we had many sexy conversations before meeting, and intimate skyping, etc. BUT we talked about our expectations for when we met and he said he didn't want our first meeting to be about sex. We talked about what we were comfortable happening, and he made sure that I knew there was no pressure on me in that area. He threw around the idea of us simply not having sex for the first visit so that our visit was about more than that, but in the end we decided together that since we both knew what the other was comfortable with, we would just see how it goes and follow each other's cues and signals. You need to have that conversation. You need to understand that it is YOUR body, and him paying for your ticket, or you wanting it to work out does not mean you owe him sex. No one ever owes anyone sex. Okay? Sex is not a scary thing, and whether or not it needs to wait for marriage or a committed relationship is the decision of the TWO people involved. If you decide to do it, you are not cheapening yourself or taking value away from your person BUT make sure you are doing it because you want to! Doing it when you feel pressured or obligated as opposed to it being because you are ready and you really WANT to is what will cheapen it. It's a difficult discussion to have, but if you do decide to do it, you will feel more comfortable with the decision knowing exactly WHY you are making it!

Good luck with your trip in August!

[innocentbutterfly]

@ThePiedPiper

I'm sorry if my post upset you, but I do take virginity seriously. Yeah call me old fashioned, but for me it wouldnt be just sex and it would all work. If he doesn't value that I'll pick my stuff first day and buy a return ticket. I just don't wanna waste in on 'being usnure'

yes I am upset, because I want to feel like I'm a part of his life and okay, maybe people dont go into details, but if you really wanna share something, who will you share it with if not with your lover?
and i'm saying it again, im not insecure, I just wanna feel like I'm a part of his life to the point that he has no problem sharing all with me. I can't feel close to him if we just talk and talk and it's never much about him, I can never know him good like that.

He didn't say that to someone 'he is close to' he talked with MY brother and said it when talk came to 'do you have a girlfriend'

okay, he's rational, but you see he is already limiting me, he made me stop talking to guy friends, not go out alone or much at all, not look guys on street, not say a word if someone says something...it's not exa*ctly me being 'free to not yet give up all for him' and he goes on and on how i would have to change religion if i want to be with him and move and learn language for his parents t accept me, I think it's right I 'complain' when he does all that and them booms me with statement of insecurity as to wait what happens when we meet and that it's just internet.

Yes, he bought it, but have you read how it came to it?
The plan 1st was always he would visit, but he lives with parents, he said 1st money was issue, then that he can't travel alone with car, then that he doesnt have free time, always something and in the end he started insisting he pays my ticket. I refused a few times, because I didnt want him to spend cash for me, because I wasnt brought up like that, boyfriend or not, but in the end he convinced me. So yes, he paid it, I appreciate it, but are you saying that this gives him the right to just rely on my visit? He's already relyong on me for so many things if this works out, I can't always be the one trying to make us work and he pays and all will be ok. It doesn't work like that for me.

And now when we had a talk as to why he didn't book a ticket on his free week, he started raging, saying I'm eating his nerves, saying if i think he shits money, yes, literally he said it and he started on and on if i want to cancel my ticket, that he'll burn it.( and its not the 1st time he tells me 'to not come' indirectly, he did it many times in anger then says again he wants me to come and he loves me and all that) That is all okay? Its not like any of these hurt me, right?
and even if I paid my own ticket I still think he would have same excuses and again I come to a point where I have to do so much when he would do so little.
I told him this behaviour he gave me after asking and becoming all cranky is not normal and doesn't exactly show 'how much he wants to meet me' and he said so what if I act like that, like I'm the idiot.

[innocentbutterfly]

@Hollandia

I'm aware of all that and thats what I don't want, the latter thing you mentioned.

@lyonsgirl

I did tell him that already, he said okay, but I don't know how he0d carry that out in real. He does tend to have quite ad ego and temper and sometimes says I don't really know him, so maybe I really don't. I just don't wanna end up going there and in the end feel like being used. Yes, I'll keep my principles, but he has to respect them too, as if he gets upset I don't know what I would do, if this happened 1st day I'd probably just see its not really what I thought and my backup plan is to go there with enough cash to buy emergency return ticket, since the one I have is for 10 days and I don't think you can leave with it earlier?

[Hollandia]

@Hollandia

I'm aware of all that and thats what I don't want, the latter thing you mentioned.

@lyonsgirl

I did tell him that already, he said okay, but I don't know how he0d carry that out in real. He does tend to have quite ad ego and temper and sometimes says I don't really know him, so maybe I really don't. I just don't wanna end up going there and in the end feel like being used. Yes, I'll keep my principles, but he has to respect them too, as if he gets upset I don't know what I would do, if this happened 1st day I'd probably just see its not really what I thought and my backup plan is to go there with enough cash to buy emergency return ticket, since the one I have is for 10 days and I don't think you can leave with it earlier?

Only you have the power to prevent it. It does not sound like so far you want to sleep with him. If you do, just make sure you go into with your eyes wide open. You should most definitely have a back up plan. I did and I think most did. If he does get upset and has a temper than leave. You can usually leave earlier by paying a penalty. I would call the airline and ask in advance. I hope your visit goes as well as you want it too.

[innocentbutterfly]

I agree with a lot of what Piper said but I think it's hard to see the situation clearly when you're in the middle of it.

Before I met my SO in person, he said a lot of the things your SO said. It made me crazy because one moment he would say I was the mot important things in his life, and the next moment he said that it wasn't a "real" relationship. We were both very insecure about the whole thing (and who wouldn't be, it's a scary thing to take the relationship up a level by meeting in person...) and it came through in different ways.

My SO and I were both not virgins when we met, and we had many sexy conversations before meeting, and intimate skyping, etc. BUT we talked about our expectations for when we met and he said he didn't want our first meeting to be about sex. We talked about what we were comfortable happening, and he made sure that I knew there was no pressure on me in that area. He threw around the idea of us simply not having sex for the first visit so that our visit was about more than that, but in the end we decided together that since we both knew what the other was comfortable with, we would just see how it goes and follow each other's cues and signals. You need to have that conversation. You need to understand that it is YOUR body, and him paying for your ticket, or you wanting it to work out does not mean you owe him sex. No one ever owes anyone sex. Okay? Sex is not a scary thing, and whether or not it needs to wait for marriage or a committed relationship is the decision of the TWO people involved. If you decide to do it, you are not cheapening yourself or taking value away from your person BUT make sure you are doing it because you want to! Doing it when you feel pressured or obligated as opposed to it being because you are ready and you really WANT to is what will cheapen it. It's a difficult discussion to have, but if you do decide to do it, you will feel more comfortable with the decision knowing exactly WHY you are making it!

Good luck with your trip in August!

Now that you mention it, we had a fight a few weeks ago that almost put and end to it, well he, mentally was already in 'its over' and he used a few excuses to 'see what he will do' and dragged me on for a week when I was falling apart to pieces emotionally, first he said he will talk to parents and ask them for advice, then he wanted to do some spiritual thing, kinda same as seeing future at psychic...so many things because he was unsure..he's 25 btw., and later we made up, but that fight, he said all the bad stuff, like for days when I cried and told him I was really miserable and didnt eat much or sleep, he kept saying he doesnt care, that his love is gone, in just one day and that he doesnt want me, he even said if I came to visit he'd kick me and leave me on the street. Little did I know he was saying all of it, because he got fed up with our fights and didnt actually mean it, so I told him to tell me all on cam and he refused excusing it on language. So you see we have been through the really bad stage before meeting already and in the end here it was when he said it's all just internet and that he really just wants to meet me now and see how I'm in real, but at the same time that meeting me doesnt bring him any happiness. That he just wants it because its close and we have to do it to finally see if this works or not...

You know how many times I tried to start 'serious' conversations and he just blew me off that I'm rushing too much, that I'm eating nerves, that I stress too much. that I doubt him etc?
Its like whenever I start it he will find some reason and say that I'm searching wrongs in him. and he just throws it at 'relax we will see'. He didn0t even make any plans for when we meet, he said we don't need them, because we will make them when I'm there.
And lately whenever he sleeps a little or he's tired he will start talking to me with words that hurt, like I wrote above what he said about ticket and he excused it on 'I'm tired, I told you that and you start jumping on me for nothing' when I just simply asked...

and a week ago I asked him what's with the place where we will stay, again, he got mad, said I'm rusing again, that August is still far and that I should leave it to him, that he hates me pressure it. And I just wanna be made sure that all is settled and not do it last minute.

[Verojoon]

Now that you mention it, we had a fight a few weeks ago that almost put and end to it, well he, mentally was already in 'its over' and he used a few excuses to 'see what he will do' and dragged me on for a week when I was falling apart to pieces emotionally, first he said he will talk to parents and ask them for advice, then he wanted to do some spiritual thing, kinda same as seeing future at psychic...so many things because he was unsure..he's 25 btw., and later we made up, but that fight, he said all the bad stuff, like for days when I cried and told him I was really miserable and didnt eat much or sleep, he kept saying he doesnt care, that his love is gone, in just one day and that he doesnt want me, he even said if I came to visit he'd kick me and leave me on the street. Little did I know he was saying all of it, because he got fed up with our fights and didnt actually mean it, so I told him to tell me all on cam and he refused excusing it on language. So you see we have been through the really bad stage before meeting already and in the end here it was when he said it's all just internet and that he really just wants to meet me now and see how I'm in real, but at the same time that meeting me doesnt bring him any happiness. That he just wants it because its close and we have to do it to finally see if this works or not...

You know how many times I tried to start 'serious' conversations and he just blew me off that I'm rushing too much, that I'm eating nerves, that I stress too much. that I doubt him etc?
Its like whenever I start it he will find some reason and say that I'm searching wrongs in him. and he just throws it at 'relax we will see'. He didn0t even make any plans for when we meet, he said we don't need them, because we will make them when I'm there.
And lately whenever he sleeps a little or he's tired he will start talking to me with words that hurt, like I wrote above what he said about ticket and he excused it on 'I'm tired, I told you that and you start jumping on me for nothing' when I just simply asked...

and a week ago I asked him what's with the place where we will stay, again, he got mad, said I'm rusing again, that August is still far and that I should leave it to him, that he hates me pressure it. And I just wanna be made sure that all is settled and not do it last minute.

I notice your SO is from Turkey and I'm wondering if a lot of the language he is using comes from a cultural barrier... I wouldn't even have thought too much about it that way except that my SO is Iranian and they have many cultural similarities with Turkey (though they often hate to admit it! LOL) and all you are saying sounds so familiar to how Siamak was before I met him... We continued having fights like this even after our first couple of visits too... For us it took a big event (a break up for several months) to be able to communicate properly... but I am sure there is better ways to do it... I think you need to really look at his actions... do they match the hurtful words? If they do, then maybe it is not worth figuring out, but if he says something (because he feels stupid feeling so much for someone he hasn't met, maybe?) but acts in a better way towards you, it may be worth trying to figure out how to fix things so you are happier. Do you think there is a way you can approach these conversation so it seems less like you are nagging? It is understandable that if you (like me) are a planner, then you will get frustrated and feel like he doesn't look forward to your visit, etc. because he is doing nothing to plan... but his personality may simply be different.

I have explained to him how planning helps me pass the time before a visit and helps me not feeling so frustrated about having to wait, so we have decided I just do the planning (for him having things planned in advance is frustrating because maybe he will change his mind for where we should go, and because it makes it seem longer...) Sometimes I let him take care of it anyways, and when I do nothing is booked until the last minute, but I don't want him to feel like I control everything... in the end we learned that communicating how we are different helps us not get annoyed... but often it takes a fight first before we know we need to communicate something... In my previous relationship I so wanted to avoid fights that when I said something that made the man annoyed, I would simply stop fighting because I didn't want to be annoying. In this relationship, I learned that sometimes I have to be annoying before we can have a good discussion about why we do what we do and how it makes the other feel.

Relationships are hard, and the problems you are describing sound like things that could happen close distance too, so it may be worth to really try to work on it with him because even if it doesn't work out, it is a good skill to learn... I know it took me way too long to learn it (I'm 33 now)

[Verojoon]

okay, he's rational, but you see he is already limiting me, he made me stop talking to guy friends, not go out alone or much at all, not look guys on street, not say a word if someone says something...it's not exa*ctly me being 'free to not yet give up all for him' and he goes on and on how i would have to change religion if i want to be with him and move and learn language for his parents t accept me,

THIS worries me. Do you really want a man who tells you who you should talk to?

[ThePiedPiper]

THIS worries me. Do you really want a man who tells you who you should talk to?

I agree with this.

You didn't upset me and I never said virginity wasn't important or that thinking it was was old-fashioned. My point was more that you seemed to be expecting sex because "that's what LD couples do" but you were in the same breath talking about not wanting to have it. The problem I had with your post was that it was hypocritical in the sense I feel like you're knocking him for the same things you're doing, whatever the motivation behind those things actually is. I wasn't upset so much as I just didn't agree with the way you were conducting your end of things, either. You did ask for people to tell you if you were overreacting, so I was attempting to answer your question.

That said, with the more detail, I would wonder if there's not something else going on. You left out a lot in your original post that, while I still might not agree with some of your behaviour, might have changed the way I approached this situation a bit. His insecurities seem to be causing him to act childish and immature and that concerns me, because no one in a relationship should have the power to make you stop talking to people you care about because they can't grow up and cope with their emotions like an adult. He's 25 and if he's talking to you this way before a visit (sometimes visits are weird and bickering increases), then I'd start to wonder. It's not so much about how often you fight as the way you fight that determines the success of a relationship and while language barriers can make it difficult, they can most definitely be worked through. Vero probably knows a bit about what she's talking about in this sense, because she seems to have faced some of these issues with her SO, but I think it's important that you and your SO learn to talk to one another, as communication is the foundation of any LDR.

Also, I don't think the way he approached the situation with getting pissed off at fighting with you was entirely fair, cultural response or not, because frankly, no one should be saying those things to their SO, but I don't know his side of it either. For example, did he say he'd throw you out on the street if you visited at random or did he say it because you continued to push the idea of a visit. Sometimes we also have to back off and learn where we're antagonizing our partners, unintentionally or not. Sometimes changing the way we respond or deal with things as they occur can change the entire dynamic of the relationship.

[innocentbutterfly]

@Verojoon by language you mean the way he expresses himself?
Well his actions, what do you categorize under this? Because yes, he does write me daily,he shows care when i got important stuff,usually he informs me where he is when he is late, but theres no other actions, because theres hardly any, thats why i asked you what you mean. And no in general they dont match, i know when he talks from anger or nerves and i started to ignore it, because i always felt hurt by them. Yes, that what u just said, feeling stupid to feel more yet. That is exactly what i noticed with him, he doesnt let go and he always wants to be perfect, even when it comes to taking an occasional pic lol but yes, im more how would i say, letting myself speak how i feel and with my actions too, so sometimes id get bothered because of that because for example when he works etc. Sometimes id send him random photos sending kisses&he never does something like that.

And there definitely is a similarity. He too doesnt wanna plan so much ahead, because of mentality, who knows what happens till then and that he would change his mind probably too. And its sooo same, usually theres a fight before my serious conversations, but usually then im blamed that im destroying our relationship because of them.. The last u said, no, i never wanted such a controlling bf, but to some extent i adopted some of his ideas and used them to show him i respect him, but of course i have limits too. That exactly is one reason too why i wanna see how hes with that in real.

[innocentbutterfly]

@thepiedpiper ill get to your post a bit later, because im tight with time right now.