We want to be together for good :)

[canadiansteve]

My girlfriend and I have been together for two years now, I think I have posted on this forum before, although at an earlier stage in our relationship. We have spent 7 months together, by miracle, as our families are quite supportive of us we were able to live in each others countries and really just get used to everything. It was by far the best time of my life, and I am now certain that she is the girl I want to be with forever.

As I said we have met each others families, and everyone got along well. My family however, likes to guilt trip me all the time about how our relationship will end up being not fair to them, however they do this to everyone and actually they can be very selfish sometimes. My girlfriend and I decided to move to Canada, as it would be almost impossible for me to get a job as I do not speak Polish. I am learning, but it's just not realistic to move there yet. Here is where the problems begin.

We are both very poor, our families struggle to survive, my parents have 6 kids, a house that's falling apart, and we live in an area with no jobs. Also, in order to have a job it requires a car and driving at least 30 minutes, so they don't save any money. My mom stays at home with the kids, and my dad only has part time work as a teacher. My girlfriends parents work 3 jobs between them and have trouble surviving on the brutal wages in Poland. My girlfriend has been unable to find a job in 6 months of looking, there is over 40% youth unemployment now in Poland, plus she is only 20 and doesn't have a degree.

Next, I am unable to afford tuition in Canada, and I feel very let down by my own country. I attended school for economics for one year but when I switched to computer science the troubles began. I am now in a legal battle with government assistance programs. They say that they paid me too for school, and I have to pay them back more money than I have ever had. Not to mention the fact that they didn't even give me enough money for school and I had to drop out in second semester because I ran out of money. I have been a straight A student, got 90% and National Honours on my high school diploma. I have always dreamed of starting my own business after getting a decent job after university, however it seems that this will never happen.

Sorry for the long post, but there was a lot to explain. So now what we want to do is get married so that at the very least we can be together. We are faced right now with the prospect of having to live apart our entire lives in dead-end jobs. I am working now, only part time retail, but I hope to be able to save up enough to get married in the summer. We have looked into all of the spousal sponsorship processes and we can't see any reason they won't accept us since there is no income requirement. Basically we know we want to get married, and we don't mind being poor as long as we can be together. I feel like being born a poor Canadian has ruined my life, perhaps only a poor American would have it worse as far as first world countries go. Basically Canada has told me that I can't have an education. So should we go ahead with it?

Any thoughts?

[lucybelle]

So are you guys planning on moving to Canada? USA visas DO have an income requirement. Also I just found this on a website because it seemed strange Canada wouldn't have an income requirement- "I don’t make very much money. Can I still sponsor my spouse?
Yes, you can. The minimum income requirements are waived for spousal sponsors; however, you are not able to sponsor someone if you are on social assistance other than disability. Also, you must convince the immigration officer that adequate financial arrangements are in place for your family member(s) after they land in Canada. This means showing to the immigration officer there is no risk you or your dependants will require social assistance in the foreseeable future. "

So although you could still sponsor, you have to prove to the government you will not go on assistant programs.

I think you need to hold your horses on this. You both are having lots of money problems, and that doesn't go away with marriage and living together. Moving internationally is EXPENSIVE. Visas are EXPENSIVE. And if you decide on even a small wedding, that will be expensive.

I know being apart sucks, but I think you both need to get in better positions before trying to close the distance. Best wishes.

[differentcountries]

You seem certain you want to be together, and has looked into how to make that happen. As for money and education, I am not familiar with the Canadian ways, maybe it would be possable to combine work and studies in some way?

[squeeker]

Hi there,

I understand poor finances. My boyfriend and I have to wait quite a few more years before we can close the distance. We struggled with it a lot, getting depressed about it and things... We decided we would go back to university.

Though I know the Canadian student loan system is quite bad with not giving enough for the whole tuition and living expenses (especially if you plan on studying full time). I have been fortunate so far, making it work with what I got, I got enough to cover the really basics, had a bit more to get a bit more of the basics.. and my SO and I have sort of passed money back and forth via Paypal when one of us happens to have a bit more than the other, etc. I tend to be a better saver, but that's also cause I have less expenses.

I think the best thing for you to do is save as much as you can, even from your part time retail job. Even if it's just a very small amount per week, and some weeks you might have a harder or easier time saving than others. Don't give up. It's awesome that you have spent 7 months together. I think if I add up the time I've spent with my SO in total, it comes to about 7 months, maybe just under, and we've been together over 3 years. We want to get married too and be together forever, but we have to wait a number of years.. we can't even visit this year likely cause of our finances being spent up by school and he is going to be busy with a big school project thing this summer so I'm going to try and work as much as I can hopefully and save a lot.

Before I started uni, I was working part time in the fast food industry and that was severely stressing me out because of the nature of the business and it felt like I was constantly saving just enough to buy a plane ticket and it felt like I spent it all on the plane ticket and then food and stuff for my SO and I when we were together.. so it was nice.. but we couldn't save up for closing the distance.. so that was frustrating. So we've had to put ourselves in a more financially insecure place to be able to have a hope for the future.. even if that takes like 4-5 or even more years to do! Depending on how things work after we graduate and if we can find jobs, etc.

It will be hard, but the best thing you two can do is save as much as possible from each paycheck, take extra hours when you can.. but in the mean time.. keep communicating with each other and building your relationship, having fun with each other from a distance, and know that you have each other and that is a great feeling to have someone who you love and who loves you. Stay strong!! I hope things work out great for you!!

[BabyGund]

As someone who has a fairly decent job in the United States, it is STILL difficult for me to immigrate to Canada. Lucybelle is right -- you need to not be on any government assistance and have to prove that you and your spouse will not go on government assistance.

If your parents will allow you both to live at home, then you have shelter covered. Assuming she speaks English or French well enough, she may be able to get her own PT retail job. You'll be together but you'll be tight.

But how will you afford the fees associated with getting the visa? I think the initial fee for her is $475 and the sponsorship fee for you is $75...don't forget fees involved for health exams and in-person interviews. I had a friend who just sponsored her husband and daughter to Canada and it was $1500 once it was all said and done.

[canadiansteve]

Thanks for your reply lucybelle, very thoughtful and I appreciate that you put some time into answering Canadian laws are quite a bit different than American laws, where it is possible to sponsor your "fiance" or "girlfriend", while in Canada it is impossible unless you are filthy rich. That is why we choose to get married, there is no form of income requirement, and in fact you only have to prove such things as, you are not unemployed, you have a good credit rating and such. I have personally known a few people who sponsored other relatives while receiving aid for school.

We do know it would be expensive (estimated around $3,000 in legal costs alone) but we plan on having a wedding in a civil ceremony that will just be the two of us. This is not ideal but we are being realistic. In Canada you also do not have to pay for a visa for a spouse, as long as the application for sponsorship is made from within Canada. She would then be able to stay here on implied status, for the duration of the decision, after which she would get permanent residency.

We are going nowhere apart, so we want to just get together and try something, maybe a few years of working we will be able to afford some cheap schooling and get better jobs. I watched my parents raise 5 kids from below the poverty line (I'm the oldest, my youngest sibling was born when I was 18), so it doesn't really seem fair to deny the right of marriage to someone.

[canadiansteve]

And to squeeker, thanks to you too for your reply. We have both tried to go to university. My girlfriend went for engineering, but she found the school to be too difficult and was failing in the maths and chemistry. I went to university originally for business, but I switched to economics and finished the year with a 3.9 GPA. Back then OSAP (Ontario version of student loans) gave me more than enough and I was fine, I actually saved almost $2,000 and paid it back before my second year. However, I then switched to computer science at York University, which I have had more of an aptitude for than economics, and I felt that it would be more enjoyable for me. This was fall 2013. Since then I have been involved in legal dispute acting as a liaison between the CRA and OSAP/NSLSC. Basically, they disagree over how much money I actually made, so they are saying that I deserve no funding, and I have to pay back $12,000 of the $14,000 I ever received.

All of this came from filing my taxes incorrectly, but even though I got my income correctly adjusted by the CRA, OSAP still disagrees and says I made over 13 grand each year. It's such a joke. To say that I'm bitter about it would be an understatement.

In the meantime, neither of us do anything fun, I save all of the money that I don't have to spend on gas, rent (my parents require me to pay for food and heating plus some amount for risk to our car), or insurance, which sadly is not much. It is possible that I will be unable to go to university until I save $12,000 so I can be eligible for OSAP again, or wait a few years for our ridiculous bureaucracy to fix this. So thats why we don't want to wait. It just seems really pointless when there is no real reason for us to stay apart.

And to BabyGund, that is why we are waiting until the summer, I need to save some money first. Also, there are some forms of government assistance are allowed, such as EI, Disability, Student Loans, generally it is just welfare that you can not go on. She does speak English, with a noticeable accent and she lacks some confidence, but still much better than the majority of my professors in our universities. Also, I'm curious, are you married to a Canadian? I think immigration in Canada (or any 1st world country for that matter) is impossible unless you are extremely wealthy, an engineer, or own a business. Sponsorship however is another matter.

[squeeker]

And to squeeker, thanks to you too for your reply. We have both tried to go to university. My girlfriend went for engineering, but she found the school to be too difficult and was failing in the maths and chemistry. I went to university originally for business, but I switched to economics and finished the year with a 3.9 GPA. Back then OSAP (Ontario version of student loans) gave me more than enough and I was fine, I actually saved almost $2,000 and paid it back before my second year. However, I then switched to computer science at York University, which I have had more of an aptitude for than economics, and I felt that it would be more enjoyable for me. This was fall 2013. Since then I have been involved in legal dispute acting as a liaison between the CRA and OSAP/NSLSC. Basically, they disagree over how much money I actually made, so they are saying that I deserve no funding, and I have to pay back $12,000 of the $14,000 I ever received.

All of this came from filing my taxes incorrectly, but even though I got my income correctly adjusted by the CRA, OSAP still disagrees and says I made over 13 grand each year. It's such a joke. To say that I'm bitter about it would be an understatement.

In the meantime, neither of us do anything fun, I save all of the money that I don't have to spend on gas, rent (my parents require me to pay for food and heating plus some amount for risk to our car), or insurance, which sadly is not much. It is possible that I will be unable to go to university until I save $12,000 so I can be eligible for OSAP again, or wait a few years for our ridiculous bureaucracy to fix this. So thats why we don't want to wait. It just seems really pointless when there is no real reason for us to stay apart.

Ohh I can see why the trouble then. That sucks that OSAP is still disagreeing even though CRA adjusted your income!! It makes me kind of worried, though my dad always takes everything to the same accountant for my family so I think it always should be done right. I see how you would feel really hopeless. So I guess I see why you would want to try and save up to get her to Canada first, and then you can start saving up to continue your education or build your skills in a certain job to be able to work your way into a job that pays better. I see how frustrating it is.. because it would be nice for you two to be able to live together while you figure things out, because then the lack of work and finances wouldn't seem so bad because at least you had your partner to hold and cuddle through it all. I wish you much luck and wisdom with what you should try and do. Maybe keep saving up and also looking out for other jobs that you might like more or than might pay you more, so that you can have an easier time saving up money. Don't give up, it'll be worth it eventually when you can figure out what will make the most sense for both of you! Hopefully the government changes or at least the student loan people in Ontario, because that sounds really stupid.

[canadiansteve]

Thanks squeeker, and yes the exact reason is basically just because it will be much easier (not to mention cheaper and less time consuming) to live together while we get things figured out. The student loans program in Canada is horrendous as you know. Out of all my friends from high school who I have stayed in contact with, only 1 is still in university, the rest have all dropped out (besides a couple who are already done apprenticeships and college) due to troubles with OSAP. Right now I am fighting with my MPP to get them to do something about it, but the stupidest part is that they only deal with their employees at OSAP, so basically anything I tell them to do has to go through a couple different offices. I don't know about loans in BC, but in Ontario you are not allowed to talk to employees of OSAP, only their representatives at each university. Apparently it's for safety reasons, because they are so incompetent at their job.

Yeah so thanks, of course I hope it is possible for us, because at the moment we are going nowhere and there are not really any prospects for that to change even in the next 5 years. I mean it is possible, but to be honest I have never had faith in the Canadian university system anyway. Even graduates are starting to have a hard time finding jobs, even in the competitive fields. Also, as you may have learned from being in an LDR, Canada is one of the most isolated first world countries in terms of emigration. Good luck to you as well.

[canadiansteve]

You seem certain you want to be together, and has looked into how to make that happen. As for money and education, I am not familiar with the Canadian ways, maybe it would be possable to combine work and studies in some way?

Yes we are completely certain we want to be together, it has been quite a long time now and there is no way either of us will give up on a good thing. As far as studying and work, it is possible in Canada in some ways, although the main trouble would be paying for living expenses, as study-work programs usually pay very poorly or not at all. How does it work in your country? Btw congratulations on your meeting, hope it went well.

[BabyGund]

Also, I'm curious, are you married to a Canadian? I think immigration in Canada (or any 1st world country for that matter) is impossible unless you are extremely wealthy, an engineer, or own a business. Sponsorship however is another matter.

Steve - I am not married to the Canadian. I was trying to immigrate on my own, just to be closer and for us to continue our relationship. I met with an immigration attorney when I visited him in Ontario. I am not wealthy but make a decent income, but my employment expertise is not in any of the 24 occupations for the federal skilled workers program. I had actually been in touch with an employer who very much wanted to employ me and my skills, but the Labour Market Opinion did not come back favorable. So unless I decide to pursue a Ph.D in Canada, marriage is the best option for immigration. But I know springing a new marriage and move of our daughter on my ex-husband, would also not go over well. My ex and I get along well -- he has unlimited access to his daughter and the move would change that. Also, I'd rather The Canadian's grown children (25 and 21) be on their own before we marry and move in together.

So that's my story in a nutshell.