On a visit and fighting. Bleh.

[samglam209]

So it's Christmas and all. Happiest day of the year.(For people that celebrate Christmas anyways) and he has to say something about how my brother got that Charles Darwin book about evolution. And how he doesn't deserve to celebrate Christmas if he doesn't believe in Jesus. Literally he said this. Ugh. I feel like he judges my family so much. I wont even be complaining and he'll call my older brother stupid. A lot. Or he'll just mention my younger brother's pot smoking or partying or religious beliefs(or as he would say lack-there-of)
I feel like I've had to change for him. I have to pretend I'm more religious than I am in front of his Grandma and I seriously feel like if we had met eachother later in life he wouldn't have even considered it because of my agnostic beliefs. It hurts my feelings and I don't know if he gets that. I haven't been this blunt about it before but ugh.
Am I wrong for being hurt by this? I'm questioning whether to just be like if you can't get over my beliefs then just end it now or if thats too blunt?
Please help.

[LadyMarchHare]

He's entitled to his opinion, but nobody's entitled to hear it. Really I think that was rude of him to say that, it sounds like this guy puts his belief system before anything else. Which I know some say put God first, but he needs to chill on that end because you shouldn't feel like you have to fake your beliefs just to satisfy someone else's. I don't think you're wrong for being hurt by it all.

Personally I'd sit him down and tell him that you respect his beliefs but that if he cannot in turn respect others', then you guys have a problem. Talk to him seriously about how you feel and point out what problems you see (such as his being overly opinionated about your brother, that was uncalled for) and see if he's willing to work through it and see past any differences in order to keep you. I hope some of that helped, best of luck to you hon.

[samglam209]

Thats exactly what I was going to do. And I've had discussions with him before and I just feel like he totally puts his beliefs before mine or he just pretends not to then goes back to his old ways. It hurts me so much.
Thanks for the advice I hope I can finally get through to him.

[LadyMarchHare]

They say the key to progress is persistence so I guess repeating the conversation may help if the first time or first few times didn't work. I can understand loving God and wanting to live a life rich in that belief, but you can't set a belief system whether religious or not before a relationship because no one likes feeling like they come second. He can love God until his brain explodes and still bite his tongue and set aside his less than stellar behavior patterns in the name of God in order to make the relationship work.

[samglam209]

I agree. The problem is when we got together we were young. He didn't believe in God back then. His beliefs have slowly changed and mine have not. Atleast not as much.I don't know maybe it's because he thinks he's "settling" since I wont completely be like oh yes I believe in God and love him so much. Because I don't. So he has to lash out at my family because they have those same beliefs. I wasn't raised in a religious household. I hope persistence will help. Thank you so much for the advice.

[lucybelle]

Man I have to say one of the things that any SO and I have to have in common is religious belief/lack of. I am completely okay with anyone believing in whichever religion they chose, but I don't want to hear about it, I don't want to argue about it, and I don't want it to create problems. I will attend religious ceremonies, I will sit quietly and nod my head during religious discussions, I expect the same respect back towards my complete lack of belief. Calling someone stupid for getting a book on evolution, or criticizing because of religious choices is seriously disrespectful. Sit him down and have a firm talk.

Good luck.

[samglam209]

Thank you. I completely agree and have been attacking him over text message.lol. And now he thinks the discussion is done when he hasn't said anything back. I don't think so! Ugh.Men.

[Bluestars]

I would be terribly hurt if I was in that situation, and I would not put up with it. I am also agnostic, but I was brought up in a Christian household. My mom has basically refused to accept the idea that I am not Christian, so I do not really talk about those kind of things to her. I almost pretend that I am Christian, kind of, but I often make remarks that make it clear that I think it is silly.

For me, I want a partner that respects my beliefs and I will respect his. I have that with my SO. He is Catholic, but he has known from the very beginning that I am agnostic and he accepts that. We both have a mutual respect--and that is a must-have for me.

If I were you, I would tell your SO basically what you wrote here. Tell him that it hurt your feelings and that he needs to be more respectful to other people's beliefs. If he doesn't change, then you have to decide if that is a deal breaker for you (it would be for me).

I hate it when people say dumb things like non-Christians should not celebrate Christmas. Seriously, the date of Christmas originated from the pagan solstice (I think?), and a lot of the traditions also have pagan origins. Today, I see Christmas more as a day to celebrate with your family and friends that you love. I did not hear one mention of Jesus today lol (up until reading this).

Edit: I do not think attacking him over text messages will solve anything. You need to have a serious discussion with him on the phone or in person.

[agentholli]

I think that different religions in a relationship can tear it apart. What happens when you have children? Its been a big deal for me in my past relationships. It is a big deal when one person makes it a big deal and can't be mature about it. I think you seriously need to have a strong talk about it with him. Its a hard subject to conquer...good luck!

[samglam209]

I tried that. My house phone is not working right now and I can't use my cell. I told him to come over tomorrow and he said the discussion was over so I wanted to know why. So we've pretty much talked it out over text message because thats just what happened. And I don't want to go to bed tonight mad at him. So I rather discuss it by any means possible.

[nicole]

Well what a lovely CHRISTIAN spirit he has? I'm atheist, but I thought Christians were supposed to be accepting and caring of everyone?? I hate when some people have a double standard; they don't want to hear about evolution and stuff like that but are quite happy to push their religious beliefs on everyone else.

You know my sister works in a care home and one of the patients is Jehovah's witness. Her family is hard core religious and yesterday told the carers she wasn't allowed to eat Christmas dinner with the other residents. The poor woman was in tears because all she wanted to do was eat her meal with company and not on her own. Nowadays, Christmas is not just a christian holiday (even though it was a pagan holiday holiday before that- Midwinter anyone???) it is a time of giving and sharing and loving, regardless of faith- everyone DESERVES to celebrate Christmas or in the case of that resident, at least eat her lunch with her friends. It's not your SO's right to say otherwise.

I think you really need to keep on this, and ask him to exercise a little more acceptance (I think the bible teaches that no?) in the future, even if he doesn't understand other people's beliefs, as this could be a major source of arguments in the future.

[milaya]

Man I have to say one of the things that any SO and I have to have in common is religious belief/lack of. I am completely okay with anyone believing in whichever religion they chose, but I don't want to hear about it, I don't want to argue about it, and I don't want it to create problems. I will attend religious ceremonies, I will sit quietly and nod my head during religious discussions, I expect the same respect back towards my complete lack of belief. Calling someone stupid for getting a book on evolution, or criticizing because of religious choices is seriously disrespectful. Sit him down and have a firm talk.

Good luck.

Couldn't agree more.

I'm an atheist, but I respect that people believe in what they want to believe, as long as they don't force their believe/religion upon me. We're free to think and believe whatever we want to and so is you and your family.
Religion always seems to create too many problems.

Which is why I must admit one thing... I respect all religions... but probably couldn't be in a relationship with a very religious person. Also because a lot of people really have strong opinions on that area.

And you need to believe in Jesus to celebrate Christmas? Think that "idea" died a long time ago to be honest. Now even "non-christian" countries celebrate Christmas. (Like Japan and lot of places in Asia). Christmas today is more just an excuse to gather the family on a decided date, have some great food, give each other presents and just all try to be having a nice time. Because we people need good times like these. Guess we need a season to be "jolly".

And one last thing... really criticizing each other's family, like you SO, is a really bad move. I feel like that's a boundary that shouldn't be overstepped. At least be very careful. And is it really needed to criticize? It's not like that family is going to change.

[Lunar Snow]

From a bit of a different perspective, I am a Christian. I am non-practising (I don't know if that's the right term, but I mean that I have faith...but attending a church and having someone else tell me what to think isn't usually my thing), though, and I do have lots of times where I question my beliefs, etc. I have been lucky that my parents, for the most part, have let me come to my own conclusions and not necessarily forced anything on my like their parents did.

My partner, I think, is agnostic. I tend to avoid the topic of religion with him often and when I do talk about it with him, it is only very positive elements that are also helping me cope with the deaths of close friends or family members--nothing to merit censure. While the differences in our beliefs haven't really presented many problems for us yet, I have noticed recently that he makes more and more acid comments about Christianity and Christians. When he has made jokes in the past, I have found them tolerable and ignored them and even sometimes laughed, too. Lately, though, some of the jokes really have been hurtful (because he knows what my beliefs are and is not considering that it might just be better to keep those jokes for someone else) and because some of them have been outright tasteless (and I would consider him a fairly cultured, educated man, but some of the comments really took me back).

I'm not sure what to add to your plight, except to echo that you do have a right to discuss this with him and how it hurts you. Edit: Not as an excuse for your guy's behaviour, but as a possible explanation, many Christians believe that it is their duty to spread the Word of God and to not keep it a secret about how they feel--there is nothing wrong with those things, in essence, but they can be twisted to say...ridiculing others who do not feel the same or showing pride and bombasticness in their love for God and using it as a method to alienate. I also wanted to say that though my situation is different from yours, in some ways, there are also similarities and I benefited from your post--me never saying anything about his comments offending me must stop and I do need to let him know sometimes if something he has said on the topic is unkind or rude. (Just as I am mindful of his difference in beliefs, I think he owes me the same respect).

Aside: The Darwin book thing reminded me of a friend's birthday party a few years ago. Now, she was a very science-oriented and analytical person, but she was (and is) joyful and showed a public presence (e.g. had posters in her dorm room, etc...though, never "forced" her beliefs on anyone) in her Christian beliefs and practice. Many of the people invited to the party were also very science-y and many of them were staunch atheists. Well, one girl gives her a magnet of the Christian fish symbol with legs added and the word "Darwin" inside (they were pretty popular at novelty shops awhile ago)--though, cheeky, I could see how they could offend very staunch Christians. She handled a gift (that, for her, wasn't the most appropriate choice) with such grace, by having a good laugh about it, exclaiming "I love it!" and putting it up on her door frame (magnetic), along with some of her other Christian paraphernalia.

I guess my point is that you can remind your boyfriend that Christianity is about tolerance, humbleness, and even humour. If he is being unkind or rude, ask him if he thinks he is behaving in a Christian manner--that will throw him for a loop.

[Richard Marks]

Man there is a lot of atheists/agnostics on this site

Time for another Christian perspective. I am a Born again Christian, I attend church on a regular basis (every sunday, plus when ever else I get the chance), read my bible daily and pray daily. My faith in God is the very core of who I am, without that faith I would literally be dead.

Saying that, your SO could be a little more tactful in what he says to you and your family. After all the way to live a christian life is to show the love of Christ in within you. That is often a hard thing to, our own sinful desires and natures make it hard. We want to do the right thing according to Christ, but at the same time we want to do what we feel is good for us. It is a quandary every Christian faces every moment of every day.

You SO is probably worried about your immortal soul, and the souls of your family, see it as him caring. He wants to see all of you in heaven, and he wants to be with all of you for eternity. He is probably very scared (even if he won't admit it) that when you die he will never see you again as you will be going to hell (sorry to be so blunt, but these are often the thought patterns of someone in a faith/non faith relationship). There is also a scripture that says that two people in a relationship are not to be unequally yoked (2nd Corinthians 6:14).

I think your SO did also go about this in the wrong way. As I said earlier, the way to live a Christian life is to show Christ's love within your life. To me this means not jumping to conclusions and saying that something is wrong. Instead I am more likely to ask questions, listen, then try to show a person what the bible says as well as trying to answer any questions that the person may have (I go through this on a regular basis with my dad )

So what to do? Talking to him is a good idea, explain where you are coming from and your point of view. But also ask about what he feels and listen. He may ask you to go to church with him, and you may want to do so every so often. Every relationship is about a little give and take.

Now as to the book, I know which book you are on about, and I have read it. My Dad gave it to me one year (after he read it) and truthfully it left me with more questions than answers. My bible gives me more answers than questions.

[LadyMarchHare]

Richard, it sounds like you're trying to justify the SO's actions more than anything. There is a line between wanting to share the word of God and try and save someone and being an outright prick to those who don't share your beliefs and acting like a religious nutbar. Yes there's probably good intention behind it, but the bible does preach tolerance for other religions and beliefs and he's honestly not showing it. Nor is he showing it by acting like his religion means more to him than someone who loves him and someone he claims to love. It's not right behavior regardless of religion. No offense meant, but just because you believe the same thing doesn't mean there's good in taking up for wayward actions and stupidity. Like I mentioned in a previous post, he can love God until his face turns blue but he needs to tone it down or risk losing people in his life. There is such thing as being an extremist.