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    #1

    I want to curl into a ball and feel sad forever...

    Well, the final incarnation of my issue with my SO is that he considered things and does still love me, but he is dead set on Amsterdam and the career as what he wants right now. He was more considerate in this conversation, but I still felt like he was making it into a him vs. me thing, which it never should have been. He was still cold and I had to tell him that I needed to hear him say how and why he wants to keep things going with us (he said he did, but it was still just all about his decision). So, yes, he is going there, but I had some hope that he would consider another place after a year and the more I asked about that, the more he went from being unsure to setting his mind that he wants to be there forever...

    I felt like I had a choice between staying together and seeing how things go and at least coming to see him there (but never having any hope that he would want to come to me ever or even meet me half way) or never talking again (I don't want to be just friends). They were both pretty rotten choices, but I have chosen that we should stay together for now and try things out. I have this very tiny hope, in order to keep myself sane, that maybe things could change...but maybe that is silly? I said that if he is making this choice and not giving any room for other possibilities and wants us to stay together, that he needs to earn back my trust and treat me with more respect and romance. He needs to make a supreme effort to heal things, because he has done and said some really hurtful things.

    Now, though, I am constantly losing out on sleep, feeling sad and hopeless, and pathetic. It's only a few days since the decision, but I am not seeing this effort that he agreed to. We still talk almost every night, but things are awkward and strained. How can I believe him now when he says he misses me or when he wishes he could hold me? How could he, as he claims, spend a week there and decide that he wants to leave me behind, a good job he has had for seven years behind, his family, and other things he supposedly cared about and enjoyed for a place and a job...and not even seem to be that sad about it? (Maybe he is...he hasn't let a webcam convo happen this whole time).

    Anyway, some words of advice or comfort would be great. There are more details I would like to hear someone else's perspective on, but I think this is okay for right now.

    p.s., We talked about seeing each other before he leaves and, at first, he said that he wasn't sure if that was a good idea and that it wouldn't change his mind. Then, later, he said that maybe he could plan a semi-surprise visit. I don't know...ugh...
    Last edited by Lunar Snow; May 15, 2012, 02:22 PM.
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    #2
    I'm so sorry to hear this!
    To me it seems that you are giving way more than him. It should be equal. So If he wants to continue this relationship it should also be him visiting you.

    My advice is to just try it out. Who knows it will work out or he will decide to come back, you've got nothing to lose!

    Who knows you'll like amsterdam and you'll decide to come live here it's a gorgeous city!

    Hopw you'll feel better!

    Comment

      #3
      I still feel like you're taking this incredibly personally. While it is a personal decision that he made, it sounds like it had absolutely nothing to do with you and everything with pursuing a goal. Given everything that happened as a result, of course things are going to feel awkward and strained; it's likely to take some time before things resume completely back to normal.

      The one thing I have to say is don't sit here and pressure him about an answer for is it temporary or forever. A lot can change in even six months, let alone an entire year, and though he can say he wants forever in Amsterdam now, that doesn't mean that's what will happen. I assume he's never spent an extended length of time there, so he'll either love it or he won't, but neither of you can determine that now. At this point it's a matter of determining whether or not a relationship is worth pursuing regardless of what happens.

      I really feel like this is a situation where you need to decide if your life goals are compatible with his. He's doing nothing wrong by going. He's following a long-term dream of his and he should be pursuing that goal; he'd resent you if he didn't (assuming you were the reason). But sometimes two people grow apart and it's up to you both to decide if that has happened or if it's worth making this work. :/ If it's worth making it work, however, I do think you need to try and not see it so much as a reflection on you. You say he's the one making it a him vs. you thing, but your posts come off as being very personally wounded that he's choosing to go. This decision is about his dream, not his relationship, and that seems to be an issue with communication that needs to be let go, else you might find it to be a reoccurring issue. :/

      ETA: I also want to add that the sparing webcam dates and the worrying about whether or not a visit would be a good idea (assuming it's not down to him being worried you'd pressure him to stay)... That all says he's having a hard time with this too. He's simply choosing to pursue something he'd regret not pursuing, but that doesn't mean he's not pained by it, struggling with it, or that his feelings aren't conflicted or hurt one bit by it.
      Last edited by Haley53; May 15, 2012, 03:13 PM.
      { Our Story on LFAD }


      Our Beginning
      Met online: February 2009
      Feelings confessed: December 2010
      Unofficially together since: January/February 2011
      Officially together since: 08 April 2011

      Our Story
      First meeting in person: 16 August - 14 September 2011
      Second visit: 17 March - 01 April 2012
      Third visit: 23 July - 13 September 2012
      Fourth visit: Looking at 23 March - 6 April 2013

      Our Happily Ever After
      to be continued...

      Comment

        #4
        Originally posted by Eclaire View Post
        I still feel like you're taking this incredibly personally. While it is a personal decision that he made, it sounds like it had absolutely nothing to do with you and everything with pursuing a goal. Given everything that happened as a result, of course things are going to feel awkward and strained; it's likely to take some time before things resume completely back to normal.

        The one thing I have to say is don't sit here and pressure him about an answer for is it temporary or forever. A lot can change in even six months, let alone an entire year, and though he can say he wants forever in Amsterdam now, that doesn't mean that's what will happen. I assume he's never spent an extended length of time there, so he'll either love it or he won't, but neither of you can determine that now. At this point it's a matter of determining whether or not a relationship is worth pursuing regardless of what happens.

        I really feel like this is a situation where you need to decide if your life goals are compatible with his. He's doing nothing wrong by going. He's following a long-term dream of his and he should be pursuing that goal; he'd resent you if he didn't (assuming you were the reason). But sometimes two people grow apart and it's up to you both to decide if that has happened or if it's worth making this work. :/ If it's worth making it work, however, I do think you need to try and not see it so much as a reflection on you. You say he's the one making it a him vs. you thing, but your posts come off as being very personally wounded that he's choosing to go. This decision is about his dream, not his relationship, and that seems to be an issue with communication that needs to be let go, else you might find it to be a reoccurring issue. :/

        ETA: I also want to add that the sparing webcam dates and the worrying about whether or not a visit would be a good idea (assuming it's not down to him being worried you'd pressure him to stay)... That all says he's having a hard time with this too. He's simply choosing to pursue something he'd regret not pursuing, but that doesn't mean he's not pained by it, struggling with it, or that his feelings aren't conflicted or hurt one bit by it.
        Good one. Also think of it like this: do you really want to be the one keeping him from following this big dream? If he would decide not to go he would always have the what ifs in the back of his mind and he might even slightly resent (although he wont express this) you for being the reason not to go,
        Just see this as a big test. If this is meant to be he will put in his effort and you will work this out. If not, then there's someone better out there for you.

        I really feel for you as I know how hard it is to let somebody go.

        Comment

          #5
          So he wants to keep the relationship going, but says basically "This is my new life. Accept it. If you want to come see me, then come. But I'm not coming that way."

          And because he still occasionally says things like "I miss you. I want to hold you" you feel like he is still interested? He may still have feelings for you. But he is committed to himself and not to the relationship, it seems.

          I don't know what kind of a man he is, but Amsterdam is a dangerous place for a single guy. (Not dangerous like he'll be hurt or killed; dangerous as in he can have his needs taken care of in other ways, not dependent on a monogamous relationship.)

          He's being selfish right now and even if you hold on and try to work things out, the period where he is going to be so enamored with his new place is not something that is going to wear off anytime soon. He's in a new place, with new people and it's different from the life he had before and he's falling in love with it.

          I want to be able to give you a little more hope, but I think you need to protect yourself from just getting more hurt.

          EDIT: Would you be willing to move out that way? Would he want you to?
          It seems from reading other respondents that I am not totally up on other past posts you may have made about this situation. If others know more about the situation, then their advice would be better suited.
          Last edited by LoveL; May 15, 2012, 03:30 PM.

          Comment

            #6
            Sorry, I have to respond quickly, as I am off to work.

            The others are wondering why I am taking it so personally and this is why. It's tremendously hurtful...this is a relationship that has gone on for awhile and had become more serious. We had goals and dreams together, too. Suddenly, now, things are all about him and this one dream and it is a like it or lump it thing.

            Yes, how can I fall in love with Amsterdam or feel like he will be faithful to me, if he is already so enamoured with it and then there are all these other very easy opportunities that he doesn't have to work hard for (if he is being selfish right now, then wouldn't it stand that he would help himself to other things, too, without a second thought?).

            That's why I am so torn...I still love him, when maybe I really shouldn't. I'm stunned, as it seems like we were going in one direction and in a very short space of time he is going in another. I can't believe that this is the person who called us "partners"...I have to protect myself and maybe that means not pursuing things with him, but I am not ready to do that. This sucks.
            Originally posted by LoveL View Post
            So he wants to keep the relationship going, but says basically "This is my new life. Accept it. If you want to come see me, then come. But I'm not coming that way."

            And because he still occasionally says things like "I miss you. I want to hold you" you feel like he is still interested? He may still have feelings for you. But he is committed to himself and not to the relationship, it seems.

            I don't know what kind of a man he is, but Amsterdam is a dangerous place for a single guy. (Not dangerous like he'll be hurt or killed; dangerous as in he can have his needs taken care of in other ways, not dependent on a monogamous relationship.)

            He's being selfish right now and even if you hold on and try to work things out, the period where he is going to be so enamored with his new place is not something that is going to wear off anytime soon. He's in a new place, with new people and it's different from the life he had before and he's falling in love with it.

            I want to be able to give you a little more hope, but I think you need to protect yourself from just getting more hurt.

            Comment

              #7
              Originally posted by LoveL View Post
              I don't know what kind of a man he is, but Amsterdam is a dangerous place for a single guy. (Not dangerous like he'll be hurt or killed; dangerous as in he can have his needs taken care of in other ways, not dependent on a monogamous relationship.)
              ....what? Just because Amsterdam has legalized prostitution doesn't mean that every male, just by virtue of being unattached, is going to flock to the red light district. What was the point of saying that?

              Comment

                #8
                Okay, that debate is worthwhile, but has another place and time. Please take it to another thread. I need people that are here to help me and offer their opinions on my situation. I don't think it is helpful to me to turn my thread into a debate on legalized prostitution.
                Originally posted by CynicalQuixotic View Post
                ....what? Just because Amsterdam has legalized prostitution doesn't mean that every male, just by virtue of being unattached, is going to flock to the red light district. What was the point of saying that?

                Comment

                  #9
                  Originally posted by CynicalQuixotic View Post
                  ....what? Just because Amsterdam has legalized prostitution doesn't mean that every male, just by virtue of being unattached, is going to flock to the red light district. What was the point of saying that?
                  Of course not every male will do that. I mentioned that I don't know what kind of man he is.
                  Don't know anything about the guy. But if he's easily lead by that stuff, it's something to consider, is it not? We don't know if he loves this place because of all the bicycles and architecture, or because of something else.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Originally posted by LoveL View Post
                    Of course not every male will do that. I mentioned that I don't know what kind of man he is.
                    Don't know anything about the guy. But if he's easily lead by that stuff, it's something to consider, is it not? We don't know if he loves this place because of all the bicycles and architecture, or because of something else.
                    Assuming that someone wants to move to Amsterdam solely because they want to frequent prostitutes is idiotic. I mean, come on. It's a first-world country with industry and history and a working economy.

                    And I have no interest in debating the legality of prostitution, Lunar Snow. I just think that insinuating that Amsterdam is 'dangerous for a single man' because of prostitutes is really narrow and offensive.
                    Last edited by CynicalQuixotic; May 15, 2012, 03:39 PM.

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Originally posted by CynicalQuixotic View Post
                      ....what? Just because Amsterdam has legalized prostitution doesn't mean that every male, just by virtue of being unattached, is going to flock to the red light district. What was the point of saying that?
                      I think the point he was trying to make is that Amsterdam is famous for its Red Light District, and that's a big reason why many, many people go to Amsterdam. Of course he didn't say that this guy would be immediately into falling into that trap, but you know what they say: when in Rome...

                      While you may think it was a sexist comment, I have to agree with him and not out of bias. That's a much different place to be than say the middle of Iowa, and if he's already clearly giving Amsterdam priority of attention, I think she should be careful in staying so attached to him, not just because it's Amsterdam, but because that new job is clearly his priority right now, and he'll be in a new place with a lot of new experiences, so she should perhaps be a little bit guarded right now.
                      Last edited by LoveJ; May 15, 2012, 03:43 PM.

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Originally posted by LoveJ View Post
                        I think the point he was trying to make is that Amsterdam is famous for its Red Light District, and that's a big reason why many, many people go to Amsterdam. Of course he didn't say that this guy would be immediately into falling into that trap, but you know what they say: when in Rome...

                        While you may think it was a sexist comment, I have to agree, with him and not out of bias. That's a much different place to be than say the middle of Iowa, and if he's already clearly giving Amsterdam priority of attention, I think she should be careful in staying so attached to him, not just because it's Amsterdam, but because that new job is clearly his priority right now, and he'll be in a new place with a lot of new experiences, so she should perhaps be a little bit guarded right now.
                        I really don't think most men who visit Amsterdam say "hey, while I'm here, I'll go have sex with a prostitute!" I think that opinion is very common when it comes to smoking pot there, but, prostitution is a very culturally loaded institution and I don't think most guys would pay for it, even in a country where it was legal, if they had a chance of picking up some girl at a bar instead.

                        I'm interested to see if any of our Dutch members weigh in on this.

                        Comment

                          #13
                          D: Yes, that's (that I should be guarded and consider all aspects of his motivation) what I ultimately took out of it, too. ...and he lives in Kansas, so you are pretty close.

                          (Aside: this is why I get frustrated with this forum, because threads often get hijacked with someone being offended about something and it turns into a big debate. I am upset and need advice and comfort. Thank you for getting it back on track. )
                          Originally posted by LoveJ View Post
                          I think the point he was trying to make is that Amsterdam is famous for its Red Light District, and that's a big reason why many, many people go to Amsterdam. Of course he didn't say that this guy would be immediately into falling into that trap, but you know what they say: when in Rome...

                          While you may think it was a sexist comment, I have to agree, with him and not out of bias. That's a much different place to be than say the middle of Iowa, and if he's already clearly giving Amsterdam priority of attention, I think she should be careful in staying so attached to him, not just because it's Amsterdam, but because that new job is clearly his priority right now, and he'll be in a new place with a lot of new experiences, so she should perhaps be a little bit guarded right now.


                          ---------- Post added at 01:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:46 PM ----------

                          Originally posted by CynicalQuixotic View Post
                          I really don't think most men who visit Amsterdam say "hey, while I'm here, I'll go have sex with a prostitute!" I think that opinion is very common when it comes to smoking pot there, but, prostitution is a very culturally loaded institution and I don't think most guys would pay for it, even in a country where it was legal, if they had a chance of picking up some girl at a bar instead.

                          I'm interested to see if any of our Dutch members weigh in on this.
                          Yes, please take that interest and make a new thread for people to weigh in on.

                          Comment

                            #14
                            My intention wasn't to hijack your thread, Lunar Snow. I thought that LoveL said was offensive and commented really in your defense, as I'd be pissed off if someone implied that my boyfriend was moving to Amsterdam because he wanted to have sex with prostitutes. I have no interest in derailing your thread, and I really am sorry for what you're going through.

                            Comment

                              #15
                              Let's just agree that advice was given on circumstances that could arise while he was there, and everyone is looking out for Lunar's best interest. What may be offensive to someone might be nothing to another; obviously that wasn't the intention.

                              Comment

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