Heartbroken, and scared.... 7 years.... over?

[ThePiedPiper]

No, she isn't the most evil human on the planet, but I still think it is wrong...and having reasons or not, we can't pretend cheating is right

I don't think ST25 was saying cheating is right or can be excused. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying, "yeah, cheating is wrong, but so is taking it upon yourself to degrade, humiliate, and harass the person who cheated." You can hold someone accountable without being a self-righteous douchebag about it, as you, Aurora, proved, but not everyone else on this thread is doing the same thing.

I didn't want to get involved, but the way some people on here arrogantly treat a large population of the forum... bothers me. I don't agree with cheating. I have never cheated. I never will. Cheating, even if it's as simple as a kiss, will always be a dealbreaker for me and not something I will ever accept in my relationships. In no way do I feel that gives me some right to cast stones and try and be the voice that says she's a disgusting human being.

We all do things we aren't proud of. Murder and rape aren't comparable to cheating, but yes, I have compassion for the people who commit murder and rape too, because more often than not, they themselves are victims of something larger than the consequences of their actions. I don't condone cheating. Cheating is wrong. But that does not mean I still won't take the time to have compassion for the cheater, because you don't cheat if there's not something deeper going on.

I agree entirely with Aurora. Sounds like there were issues from both ends. This relationship is toxic and they both made mistakes. One is not more forgiveable than the other. Yes, cheating is wrong, but so is responding in such a way that you make your partner you feel scared to express who they are in your own relationship. Just because she chose to cheat and he chose to continuously say he'd change and never did... that doesn't mean one of them deserves compassion and the other doesn't.

I feel very sorry for what both parties are going through. I have compassion for both of their struggles. However, there is a point where one uses a relationship to compensate for their own emotional issues and the relationship will never work from that point forward. I think this relationship has reached that point. I hope the both of them get the help that they need, because I feel both would benefit from professional help.

[kattermole]

I don't think ST25 was saying cheating is right or can be excused. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying, "yeah, cheating is wrong, but so is taking it upon yourself to degrade, humiliate, and harass the person who cheated." You can hold someone accountable without being a self-righteous douchebag about it, as you, Aurora, proved, but not everyone else on this thread is doing the same thing.

I didn't want to get involved, but the way some people on here arrogantly treat a large population of the forum... bothers me. I don't agree with cheating. I have never cheated. I never will. Cheating, even if it's as simple as a kiss, will always be a dealbreaker for me and not something I will ever accept in my relationships. In no way do I feel that gives me some right to cast stones and try and be the voice that says she's a disgusting human being.

We all do things we aren't proud of. Murder and rape aren't comparable to cheating, but yes, I have compassion for the people who commit murder and rape too, because more often than not, they themselves are victims of something larger than the consequences of their actions. I don't condone cheating. Cheating is wrong. But that does not mean I still won't take the time to have compassion for the cheater, because you don't cheat if there's not something deeper going on.

I agree entirely with Aurora. Sounds like there were issues from both ends. This relationship is toxic and they both made mistakes. One is not more forgiveable than the other. Yes, cheating is wrong, but so is responding in such a way that you make your partner you feel scared to express who they are in your own relationship. Just because she chose to cheat and he chose to continuously say he'd change and never did... that doesn't mean one of them deserves compassion and the other doesn't.

I feel very sorry for what both parties are going through. I have compassion for both of their struggles. However, there is a point where one uses a relationship to compensate for their own emotional issues and the relationship will never work from that point forward. I think this relationship has reached that point. I hope the both of them get the help that they need, because I feel both would benefit from professional help.

Great post PP. I've avoided posting much on this thread up until now but the way it's turned out has made me feel quite uncomfortable. I think there's a danger of people using their own emotional experiences and hurt that they (quite rightly) still feel in their responses and some of the posts come across as a bit hysterical, frankly.

I think it's important this place remains somewhere people can come for advice and help. Sometimes humans make mistakes and hurt other people, that's just life, and it doesn't necessarily mean you are an evil person. I get the anger here, I really do, but I think some of it is misplaced and better directed at the people who have hurt YOU, not someone who clearly has some issues and posted on here hoping to get a bit of help. I just feel a bit sad for the pair of them, neither of them are happy right now and I don't really see the value in pages of ripping someone apart who already is pretty low. I'm not sure it serves any purpose other than fuelling your own anger about things that have happened to you in the past.

Just my thoughts, bowing out of this now.

[Hollandia]

I think for some of us that got cheated on and had to deal with huge repercussions from it, we look at this a bit different. I again say, she did it for seven months. You have a right to your opinion on how you perceive that and I have a right to how I do. I think I could think of a few terms to call all this 'touchy lovey forgive everyone for their crimes" mentality but I won't insult some of you although some are here are not afraid to. I completely disagree. I consider this enabling mentality and very dangerous standard to set.

I won't debate that, but she did the deed and deserves anything she gets from it. If she gets enough grief and not quite so much understanding, maybe she won't do it to someone else in the future. If she keeps hearing all this compassion and understanding, then why should she not just do it again? People really need to be held accountable for their actions or they, just like most children, will just do it again. This is part of what is wrong with society in general today. There is an excuse for everything and so we are teaching those that do these things it is okay.

I never said murder and rape were the same, I mentioned them to make the point that some of them have good reasons too. As well as the other more taboo ways of cheating. I am sorry I don't have compassion for someone that takes a life, rapes a person or rapes or beats a child. Ever. You do, I don't. I never will. As I said we all have our own lines and yours and mine are miles apart. Am I a douchbag for that in your opinion? That is a pretty harsh comment for not being willing to forgive someone that mistreated another human being so badly for so long.

[LadyDaemon]

I'll just say this last thing and then like Kattermole I'm out of this because it has gotten a bit out of hand.

I have said it before and I'll say it again,I never condone cheating or lying under any circumstances. I'm a firm believer that if there is something bad enough in your situation or relationship that would push you to cheating or lying then both parties either need to handle it like adults and try to fix it or leave. I myself have no compassion for her because of what she did,but I did not bash the hell out of her with some of the strong language that was used. I think there are a couple of people here who were way out of line for saying some of the things they said about this girl. You don't have to agree with or condone her actions but you also don't have to like verbally beat the hell out of her either. If you think she deserves what she gets then fine,so be it,but let other forces like that little thing called Karma deal with it. It is not our place to punish her for her actions verbally or otherwise.

I've been cheated on numerous times as stated before but I tried to be indifferent outside of having used my own experience to demonstrate likelihood of it happening again,but that's also because I only have my experience and things I've seen to go off of. So,I think if you're really emotionally close to the issue and can't be indifferent then maybe you should step away from this thread. That is all.

[ST25]

Fear and insecurity is not an excuse,you either deal with it and work it out like adults or you leave. There may always be a reason but that doesn't make it a good one or a legit one. I honestly think that once you cheat on someone then there's a significantly higher chance that it will happen again. I was with someone for 3 years and he cheated on me 7 different times with 7 different people. Every guy before and after him have all cheated on me and once they did it the first time they went and did it again even though I gave them a second chance. So,forgive me for my lack of compassion for what you're saying.

So just because a bunch of men cheated on you, that means that everyone else who cheated once will cheat again? Everyone's different and probably the OP's SO.

But yeah, getting out of this thread now because comparing cheating to murder and rape is beyond ridiculous and extremist. I'm not even going to venture that far into trying to rationalize that logic.

[LadyDaemon]

So just because a bunch of men cheated on you, that means that everyone else who cheated once will cheat again? Everyone's different and probably the OP's SO.

But yeah, getting out of this thread now because comparing cheating to murder and rape is beyond ridiculous and extremist. I'm not even going to venture that far into trying to rationalize that logic.

I didn't say that. I said the likelihood of it happening again is higher and yes I used my experience because like I said before,I can only go off what I've experienced and what I've seen from the people around me. But yes,I would say most of the time if they've cheated once they will again.

annddd seriously this time,I'm out. *POOF*

[ThePiedPiper]

I think for some of us that got cheated on and had to deal with huge repercussions from it, we look at this a bit different. I again say, she did it for seven months. You have a right to your opinion on how you perceive that and I have a right to how I do. I think I could think of a few terms to call all this 'touchy lovey forgive everyone for their crimes" mentality but I won't insult some of you although some are here are not afraid to. I completely disagree. I consider this enabling mentality and very dangerous standard to set.

I won't debate that, but she did the deed and deserves anything she gets from it. If she gets enough grief and not quite so much understanding, maybe she won't do it to someone else in the future. If she keeps hearing all this compassion and understanding, then why should she not just do it again? People really need to be held accountable for their actions or they, just like most children, will just do it again. This is part of what is wrong with society in general today. There is an excuse for everything and so we are teaching those that do these things it is okay.

I never said murder and rape were the same, I mentioned them to make the point that some of them have good reasons too. As well as the other more taboo ways of cheating. I am sorry I don't have compassion for someone that takes a life, rapes a person or rapes or beats a child. Ever. You do, I don't. I never will. As I said we all have our own lines and yours and mine are miles apart. Am I a douchbag for that in your opinion? That is a pretty harsh comment for not being willing to forgive someone that mistreated another human being so badly for so long.

And arguably, if she had received the appropriate help for her issues, her behaviour would not have resulted in cheating, same as had he received appropriate (and deserved) help for the abuse he's gone through, then maybe he would not have, in turn, abused or borderline abused her. Even he admitted to saying and doing several things as a result of being raised in an abusive household and he promised her he would change but it took him time before he was actually able to move past it enough to do so; that doesn't mean the damage wasn't done and he himself admitted that she has a hard time opening up about her opinions as a result of his behaviour. I hold him accountable for that, but I also have compassion for the abuse that he's been through. You seem to think holding someone accountable means not forgiving that person of their crime. Wrong. I have been raped, cheated on, and beat, some of those repeatedly, and I have learned to forgive and let go and move on. My father's abuse was perpetuated by the years of horrible abuse and neglect he suffered as a child. In no way do I think what he's ever done to me is right, but I understand that it has nothing to do with me and that he never once received compassion for all the shit he's been through. I was cheated on by my first boyfriend. I ended our relationship as a result of it. It does me no good to be bitter about it and resent him and everyone else who cheats because I realise it had nothing to do with me but with his own insecurity and issues that he was struggling to deal with. In no way does having compassion for either him or my father say "oh hey, what they did was a-okay with me. They can do it again!" No, they were wrong, but it'd be absolutely arrogant of me to think I should have anything to do with the consequences when they will face their own consequences for what they've done, and they both have.

You seem to think having compassion for people is synonymous with making excuses for them and letting things go, that if I have compassion for Uncle Jerry who touches his nephew because he himself is fucked up from having been touched repeatedly and not believed, then I somehow am saying Uncle Jerry should be allowed to touch his nephew and I'm not. I'm also not saying his abuse is an excuse for his behaviour because it's our responsibility as individuals to seek help and work through our issues to break the cycles we're sometimes born into. But I am saying that a lack of compassion is why help is so hard to get in the first place and why mental health resources even for rich individuals are sorely lacking. I am not insulted by you or anything you would have to say, so don't hold back, but please at least do not put words in my mouth and say I'm somehow saying we should all be excused just because I believe in forgiveness. Forgiveness isn't about excusing someone's actions and sweeping them under the rug. Forgiveness is accepting that they happened and still living your life compassionately regardless.

You may think what you like of my opinions - history has shown we both have very different ones - but at the very least, dislike me for the right opinions. I am not saying she deserves to be excused or that her mental health makes her cheating less wrong. I am just saying that she will suffer the natural consequences of her actions and it's not up to the rest of the world to hog tie her and leave her in the middle of town to have rocks and insults hurled at her. You can hold someone accountable without stooping so low as to degrade, humiliate, harass, and curse at them.

[ThePiedPiper]

I didn't say that. I said the likelihood of it happening again is higher and yes I used my experience because like I said before,I can only go off what I've experienced and what I've seen from the people around me. But yes,I would say most of the time if they've cheated once they will again.

annddd seriously this time,I'm out. *POOF*

I do somewhat agree with this. I have seen people grow out of cheating, but that's after it happened a few times over and they dealt with the unpleasant consequences. I do think that it's hard not to cheat on the same person again, once they've shown you they'll forgive it. It's why it's a dealbreaker for me. I would never be able to trust my partner again. However, I do think people who cheated in the past can eventually reach a point of not cheating again, but it does take personal growth and transformation in order to be able to do so.

[Hollandia]

And arguably, if she had received the appropriate help for her issues, her behaviour would not have resulted in cheating, same as had he received appropriate (and deserved) help for the abuse he's gone through, then maybe he would not have, in turn, abused or borderline abused her. Even he admitted to saying and doing several things as a result of being raised in an abusive household and he promised her he would change but it took him time before he was actually able to move past it enough to do so; that doesn't mean the damage wasn't done and he himself admitted that she has a hard time opening up about her opinions as a result of his behaviour. I hold him accountable for that, but I also have compassion for the abuse that he's been through. You seem to think holding someone accountable means not forgiving that person of their crime. Wrong. I have been raped, cheated on, and beat, some of those repeatedly, and I have learned to forgive and let go and move on. My father's abuse was perpetuated by the years of horrible abuse and neglect he suffered as a child. In no way do I think what he's ever done to me is right, but I understand that it has nothing to do with me and that he never once received compassion for all the shit he's been through. I was cheated on by my first boyfriend. I ended our relationship as a result of it. It does me no good to be bitter about it and resent him and everyone else who cheats because I realise it had nothing to do with me but with his own insecurity and issues that he was struggling to deal with. In no way does having compassion for either him or my father say "oh hey, what they did was a-okay with me. They can do it again!" No, they were wrong, but it'd be absolutely arrogant of me to think I should have anything to do with the consequences when they will face their own consequences for what they've done, and they both have.

You seem to think having compassion for people is synonymous with making excuses for them and letting things go, that if I have compassion for Uncle Jerry who touches his nephew because he himself is fucked up from having been touched repeatedly and not believed, then I somehow am saying Uncle Jerry should be allowed to touch his nephew and I'm not. I'm also not saying his abuse is an excuse for his behaviour because it's our responsibility as individuals to seek help and work through our issues to break the cycles we're sometimes born into. But I am saying that a lack of compassion is why help is so hard to get in the first place and why mental health resources even for rich individuals are sorely lacking. I am not insulted by you or anything you would have to say, so don't hold back, but please at least do not put words in my mouth and say I'm somehow saying we should all be excused just because I believe in forgiveness. Forgiveness isn't about excusing someone's actions and sweeping them under the rug. Forgiveness is accepting that they happened and still living your life compassionately regardless.

You may think what you like of my opinions - history has shown we both have very different ones - but at the very least, dislike me for the right opinions. I am not saying she deserves to be excused or that her mental health makes her cheating less wrong. I am just saying that she will suffer the natural consequences of her actions and it's not up to the rest of the world to hog tie her and leave her in the middle of town to have rocks and insults hurled at her. You can hold someone accountable without stooping so low as to degrade, humiliate, harass, and curse at them.

I really still disagree and I don't dislike you at all either. I just feel that a few rough words don't even touch the pain that she caused. I don't feel sorry for the perpetrator of the offenses like you do. She is not being hauled off to jail or beaten but being given a piece of a few of our minds. Poor her. I don't feel bad for her at all. I know you think it wrong but I still feel this type of mentality is enabling and still believe it is a dangerous standard to set. You and I completely disagree on this matter.

Do you think the pain of a few words,cuss or not, come close to how she hurt him? Was she not aware people would have these thoughts as she was f@ck@ing her co-worker time after time? Piper she did it over and over and over again. She lied to him , over and over and over again. What on earth happened to morals in this world? I have had pain in my life too but I would never resort to something like this because of it. She hurt another human being, she lied to him for 7 months and she manipulated him into waiting for her. That is something that is not just lashing out.

You all can get as upset as you want about the comparisons, but you cannot open the door of "having good reasons" without drawing a line, I am trying to point out where is that line??? Cheating one time, two, five, 100, beating, raping or killing....follow the progression. When is a "good reason" acceptable when is it just an excuse?

I don't regret any my words, not a single one. I hope my harsh words might sink in a hair but I highly doubt it.

[ThePiedPiper]

I really still disagree and I don't dislike you at all either. I just feel that a few rough words don't even touch the pain that she caused. I don't feel sorry for the perpetrator of the offenses like you do. She is not being hauled off to jail or beaten but being given a piece of a few of our minds. Poor her. I don't feel bad for her at all. I know you think it wrong but I still feel this type of mentality is enabling and still believe it is a dangerous standard to set. You and I completely disagree on this matter.

Do you think the pain of a few words,cuss or not, come close to how she hurt him? Was she not aware people would have these thoughts as she was f@ck@ing her co-worker time after time? Piper she did it over and over and over again. She lied to him , over and over and over again. What on earth happened to morals in this world? I have had pain in my life too but I would never resort to something like this because of it. She hurt another human being, she lied to him for 7 months and she manipulated him into waiting for her. That is something that is not just lashing out.

You all can get as upset as you want about the comparisons, but you cannot open the door of "having good reasons" without drawing a line, I am trying to point out where is that line??? Cheating one time, two, five, 100, beating, raping or killing....follow the progression. When is a "good reason" acceptable when is it just an excuse?

I don't regret any my words, not a single one. I hope my harsh words might sink in a hair but I highly doubt it.

All I will say is I never said there is a good reason to cheat, or anything more than that (murder, rape, etc.). Not once did I ever say there was a good reason to do it, nor did I ever say it was okay either.

I don't disagree with what she did was wrong. I just disagree with people thinking they have the right to play God and dole out her consequences.

[Hollandia]

All I will say is I never said there is a good reason to cheat, or anything more than that (murder, rape, etc.). Not once did I ever say there was a good reason to do it, nor did I ever say it was okay either.

I don't disagree with what she did was wrong. I just disagree with people thinking they have the right to play God and dole out her consequences.

It is words and opinions and we all have a right to ours. She opened herself up to that when she treated another human being the way she did.

I did not say to cut off her left t#T or something some parts of the world would do, but I am not going to mince words about how horrid it was and how lowly I think of her for doing it. I am calling it as I see it. There are hundred of posters here, some feel one way and some feel another. Neither is right or wrong. We just feel what we feel. I believe in tough love too, some people don't. I do. I look at this much the same way.

She came on here, nobody forced here too. She wants to tell her side of it, are you kidding me? This thread was for her SO to ask for advice about what she did to him. SHE made it public by joining in, I consider that another manipulation. She will get no sympathy from me and she should be begging his forgiveness behind closed doors for how she hurt him. She gets no slack from me. She brought it on herself.

[LadyDaemon]

I do somewhat agree with this. I have seen people grow out of cheating, but that's after it happened a few times over and they dealt with the unpleasant consequences. I do think that it's hard not to cheat on the same person again, once they've shown you they'll forgive it. It's why it's a dealbreaker for me. I would never be able to trust my partner again. However, I do think people who cheated in the past can eventually reach a point of not cheating again, but it does take personal growth and transformation in order to be able to do so.

Fair enough.